Resources for Nedarim 12

1.     The גמרא says that if you are מתפּיס in "חלתו של אהרן ותרומתו" the נדר is not חל since it is not called a דבר הנדור. There are several explanations given in the ראשונים for this. The ר"ן says that since the תרומה is מותר לזרים it is not called a דבר הנדור. It is clear from the ר"ן that the phrase that something must be a “דבר הנדור ולא דבר האסור” is focused on the “דבר הנדור” part and not the “ולא דבר האסור” part. In other words, התפסה must be with something you made (fully) אסור (a דבר הנדור), and not focused on whether the item was a דבר האסור. The רמב"ם in הלכות נדרים פּרק א׳ הל׳ י"ﭏ says that the reason התפסה doesn’t work with תרומה is because תרומה can’t be brought as a נדר or נדבה so it isn’t a דבר הנדור. The רא"ש and תוספות say that the issue with תרומה is that it was already אסור because of טבל and all you did by making it תרומה was make it more מותר in that כהנים can now eat it so it is not called a דבר הנדור. The אתוון דאורייתא in כלל ב learns from here that when you are מפריש תרומה, the איסור לזרים is not an איסור תרומה but rather the איסור of טבל that never went away since if it had gone away and had been replaced by a new איסור called תרומה לזר it would be a דבר הנדור in the sense that your words caused it! He is then דוחה as it may that a new איסור came and yet it still isn’t a דבר הנדור since it had been in a state of איסור before you said anything and that didn’t change. Interestingly, he then brings a ראיה from רש"י that the exact opposite may be true since רש"י in יבמות דף פּ"ו ע"א says that איסור of טבל is because of the תרומה that is מעורב inside. תוספות over there disagrees since if that were true then כהנים should be able to eat טבל. רש"י apparently holds that the כהנים aren’t themselves זוכה בתרומה at all until the person is מפריש, similar to how he isn’t זוכה בחזה ושוק till it is separated out דמשלחן גבוה כזכו. That would mean that תרומה would also be considered דמשלחן גבוה כזכו.

2.     The גמרא says that if someone is מתפּיס with the day גדליה בן אחיקם died that it is a good נדר. The ר"ן points out that התפסה works with any איסור דרבנן. It is considered a דבר הנדור even though the item was already אסור before you spoke מדרבנן. The רמב"ן in ספר המצוות in שורש א asks this as a question on theרמב"ם who holds that every איסור דרבנן is really an איסור דאורייתא because of לא תסור. If so, everything אסור מדרבנן should be considered a דבר האסור, yet our גמרא says it works for התפסה. The מהר"ץ חיות brings this and says theרמב"ן there has an answer but אגב mentions an important point: he says there is no question that an איסור דרבנן is considered a דבר האסור and if you are מתפּיס באיסור דרבנן it is not valid. Our גמרא is discussing a case where you made a separate נדר to not eat on צום גדליה and then wanted to be מתפּיס with that. That works since your נדר is חל. But had you just said this food is אסור to me like that piece of chicken and milk then it would not work.

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